Tuesday, August 25, 2009

Cheery Times

I've been in three studios in as many days, and the theme that echoes back to me as I stumble around the halls is: "Our morale is crappy". Which is understandable given the staff reductions and salary rollbacks, not to mention the general good times in which we now live.

The plunging morale issue isn't news to anybody paying attention, but a new report highlights part of the problem.

A report called "Talent Tightrope: Managing the Workplace through the Downturn", has found that employers are unaware of their employees’ stress levels.

Hudson executive general manager Marc Burrage says that 44 percent of the 2394 employees surveyed indicted that worker morale has plummeted.

“In contrast, only 26 percent of the 247 employers interviewed acknowledge that workplace morale has dropped.”

He adds that local companies have responded to the global recession by slashing workforce costs through restructures and staff cuts ...

Almost a third of employees are concerned about losing their jobs. This is a very different scenario to only one year ago. Nearly half [42 percent] said they feel their job is less secure than the same time last year ...

I think the general cluelessness of employers referenced in the report is reflected in the actions of various animation studios (They are, after all, employers too.)

I could think of a bunch of examples, but let me give you one: During the recent contract negotiations, a studio rep came to us during the contract-talk equivalent of the ninth inning and proposed getting rid of his company's sick days. I told him I thought the proposal was on the late side, and also a bad idea. I then told the employees, and an already bad morale situation got worse.

In fact, the employees went sort of ape shit.

The studio, after due consideration, decided getting rid of sick days was maybe not such a swift idea after all and withdrew the proposal.

But here's my point: I think the idea was put forward in the first place because the company's management didn't have a clear grasp of how ticked off employees already were.

(Management, in my experience, often gets caught up in an echo chamber of its own design where it hears what it wants to hear, and tunes out bad news that gets in the way of preconceived notions. Let's stipulate here that it's often difficult to burrow down to cold, hard reality; a lot of union members tell me what they think I want to hear. So I'm not always the recipient of clear, shining truth either.)

The lesson in this story, I think, is that it's a good idea for corporate administrators to communicate with A) each other and B) the employees whose benefits they feel compelled to take away. "Talking things out" beforehand isn't necessarily going to solve the problem and it probably won't make people perform jigs in the hallways, but it will go a considerable distance in avoiding bigger mistakes and cushioning some of the blows that now fall on the folks who have to work for a living.

60 comments:

Anonymous said...

Why is this a surprise? With 8 years of no leadership at the top in this country, unregulated greed, and a demoralizing, needless war--to say nothing of the bush administrations slap in the face of the U.S. Constitution--and the sad apathy and ignorance of a good portion of the U.S. Citizenry--here we are. Shameless, unethical republicans, and spineless members of the Democratic Party have done nothing to bring dick and bush to the chopping block for their treasonous acts, while our President Obama and the current Congress are saddled with undoing the bush economic debacle.

Of course, all of the above was nothing but a distraction for big business to squeeze the workers for a quick buck, while shipping more and more jobs overseas for an even quicker buck. The hiring of more "hr" types and "consultants" who spout corporate "change" b.s. like "glass half full" in a lame attempt to put a barrier of bureaucracy between employees and upper management has added to workers frustration rather than helping alleviate it.

Piling on more levels of bureaucracy shields upper management from having to communicate directly with employees, while the "bureaucratic class" digs in to justify their jobs, ingratiating themselves to upper management by rattling employees whose often justified frustration bubbles over. Nothing new--but more intense than ever.

If there was only ONE aspect of the idiotic "trickle down" theory that worked, it's demoralization.


Only 6 months into his Presidency, President Barak Obama has had to spend a lot of our money undoing the damage of the last 8 years. It's clearly beginning to work--slowly. No one's happy about having to do that--but then no one was happy with an idiot for President (who spent trillions for naught) for 8 years, either.

Anonymous said...

Bush was horrible, good riddance , and I'm glad McCain didn't get in either, but don't fool yourself : at the end of the day Obama is one of them . (maybe just not so obvious. He's better spoken and smarter than Bush. He's a slick package.) But Obama is a globalist corporate shill, too. He can't go against the corporations or he'll be finished politically. No off-shored jobs are coming back here. And how's the withdrawal from Iraq going ? Guantanamo still open ? etc., etc.

Wake up.

Collective Anonymous Animation Employees said...

and furthermore:

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!

Anonymous said...

But thank god he's funding oil drilling in Brazil! The important part: that its in Brazil! Because if it was in Alaska, then it would be the kind of old, wasteful, carbon fuel expense that the new green initiative is against.

Its in Brazil, you see. Thats different

http://tinyurl.com/ll825q

limo hire said...

i think that is not big surprise .....

Anonymous said...

I dont think anyone can blame who is (or was) in the White House for companies like Disney or Dreamworks being buffoons to their employees. That's just pure capitalism and the rich taking advantage of the poor.

I doubt Mr. Bush told the execs at Disney or Nickelodeon or wherever to take sick days away. Im sure some pencil neck was given the task to decrease overhead, and made a brainless move by requesting to remove sick days. The problem is no one has any balls to go after the REAL problem: the millions and millions dolled out to execs when their talented employees who actually MAKE their films cant even afford to buy a house in LA.

That would be a fun survey: How many animators in the union own a home? I would guess less than 50%

Anonymous said...

It's just the casino of entertainment. Corporations make widgets. Movies and tv shows are not widgets.

Anonymous said...

I can't believe some schmucks here are blaming Bush for animators' job woes. They're perfect caricatures of the foaming, wild-eyed, paranoid, hate-filled Left. The kind Bill O'Reilly gleefully skewers on his show every night. And racks up big ratings, I might add. You guys are pitiful. Especially regarding the recent presidential election. Yeah, thank god we passed over a genuine war hero with a sterling record of voting against pork projects and entitlements and earmarks and FOR the taxpayer in favor of a do-nothing senator who was buddy-buddy with a would-be terrorist murderer and his copkiller wife, and oh YEAH that preacher who reinforces Glenn Beck's idea that Obama has a deep-seated hatred of the white race (if he doesn't, why did he attend for 20 YEARS a church that advocated that hatred?)

Gee, where did all that stuff above come from? Heck, in THIS environment, it writes itself.

Anonymous said...

"It's just the casino of entertainment. Corporations make widgets. Movies and tv shows are not widgets."

Corporations seem to do less and less. Movies and tv shows are becoming more and more like the mythical widget.

Somehow we've bought into a faulty bill of goods when it comes to going along with what's going on because *gasp!* we wouldn't get hired if we didn't bow down to the stricter schedules, the insane changes made while having to stick to those schedules, the stagnant pay, the lack of loyalty by the studios to their employees, etc. Where has that gotten us? Certainly no bonuses, golden parachutes, steady jobs, etc. that the heads of the studios get.

Instead we get tests by our peers for jobs, overworked, underpaid, and the fear that if we take a sick day because we're SICK, we'll never work in this town again.

What a business!

Anonymous said...

Extreme left wing and extreme right wing....

What do they have in common? Extreme idiots.

Steve Hulett said...

I'm not going to go all political here, but just point out the reality of the country today.

We live in a corporatist state.

Some folks think this is fine, others don't. All I know is the country is a considerably different place than when I played cap guns in the vacant lots of La Crescenta during the Eisenhower Administration.

Of course, the country would be different anyway, what with demographic changes, technology revolutions, and the differences in the wider world.

But let me highlight one thing: there is now a greater concentration of wealth in the U.S. of A. than at any time since the pre-Depression twenties.

Some think this isn't a problem. I do.

Steve Hulett said...

This lays out who's got what:

http://www.faculty.fairfield.edu/faculty/hodgson/Courses/so11/stratification/income&wealth.htm

And this:

http://rawstory.com/08/news/2009/08/15/concentration-of-wealth-in-hands-of-rich/

Google it and the obvious pops right up.

rufus said...

I remember Bush trying to get rid of the 40 hour per week standard.

What a dushbag.

rufus

Anonymous said...

>>Movies and tv shows are becoming more and more like the mythical widget.

I agree, but the art usually starts off with an attempt to be original at the earliest stages. It's just that as a work gets raised higher up the flag, the more exposure it has to capital investment, which requires, lives and breathes by, predictable forecasts. If the end product is something as small as a published book, there is less exposure to the requirements of large capital. Unfortunately, there is no in between off ramp - ie, no middle class economy for art. It's either very small and independent or a blockbuster media franchise. Reflection of a lost middle class, I expect. A healthy culture needs a healthy middle class of anything, even art. We are gutted without it. Look at the implosion of middle class acting professionals. So art gets picked early from the vine, before it is ripe, and is ripped to shreds with an artificial injection of 50-100 million dollars. Then on to the next thing. Corporatism eats babies.

>>But let me highlight one thing: there is now a greater concentration of wealth in the U.S. of A. than at any time since the pre-Depression twenties.

Concentration of wealth, true. But actual wealth of the country. No way. The country is in massive debt and ruin. When people use the line "We are the richest country in the world, we surely can afford to take care of our citizens," it's dead wrong. The citizenry is totally and hopelessly bankrupt. There is no public wealth. The only wealth you might be referring to are the top 1% of wage-earning 'citizens' who keep private residencies in a variety of American cities. There is no way to tap that wealth as it is completely beholden to the dynamics of global economics. The wealth you refer to is fundamentally based on the bet that the United States will fail. So far, it is a very good bet. That's the paradox.

Simply put, our giant debt represents all claims that investors from around the world make UPON WORK THAT YOU WILL DO FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE AND THE WORK THAT YOUR KIDS WILL DO FOR THE REST OF THEIRS. It is financial slavery. Our parents and their parents spent every dime, and Nixon put the final period on the our hopeless slide by removing us from the gold standard once and for all. We were sold out by every generation that came before us for a long, long time now.

You still can't trust anyone over thirty, as they continue to reach into your pocket to pay for their debts. Especially don't trust the generation that gave us that line - they've resorted to reaching into the piggy banks of the kids you haven't even had yet. The only thing I may hate more than Middle-East invading Evangelists are Boomers. Between the lot, they've let the banks fuck us real good.

Anonymous said...

Well, that seems a bit too gloom and doom to me...I mean, unless the buildings are falling down and people are dying in the streets of gunshot wounds from the mobs of looters and rapists and no police presence, I'm pretty sure our nation isnt in "ruin."

Are we going to continue to be a world superpower in the next 200 years, probably not, and actually, thats fine with me.

Anonymous said...

"Well, that seems a bit too gloom and doom to me...I mean, unless the buildings are falling down and people are dying in the streets of gunshot wounds from the mobs of looters and rapists and no police presence, I'm pretty sure our nation isnt in "ruin.""

Been reading the news much?

City infrastructure isn't being updated. City roads are a mess. In LA, rape kits aren't being processed because of cost. LAUSD is rethinking who runs the schools. Allegedly, the economy is in "recovery", but HOW is that so when unemployment is so high? Who's recovering? Not the middle class...it's disappearing.

And speaking of jobs...how's it going in animationland? It sucks, frankly. Cliques, tests, ugly deadlines for ugly shows. No one is going to care about the shows being produced five years from now, much less fifty. The studios have decided that short-term profits are better than long-term investments, which follows the party line of the entire US business system.

We gotta take what we can, because no one is going to give it to us if we don't think we're worth something.

Anonymous said...

Lay off the the Boomers already, Thumb Twidlers- it's not our fault. We were doing the same thing then that we're all doing now; fighting greed and corporatism run amok.

Then, it manifested itself as the Viet Nam war. Now it's "globalism." It goes all the way back to the industrial revolution and the plantation economy before it; power without responsibility, soulless greed.

Corporatism's greatest infomercial host was Ronald Reagan. Today's Conservatives are still clinging to every word he said like it was the Sermon on the Mount. If you agree with them you're "patriotic." If you disagree you're a "socialist."

I believe that Obama is exactly what he seems to be- no more, no less. He is a bright, honest, dedicated public servant who is trying to fix what's broken. The forces against him, however, are powerful determined, and deeply entrenched. They won't change just because you ask them politely.

Anonymous said...

Been reading the news much?

Its not as bad as you're claiming. Maybe it'll get there someday, but as of now, it's a pretty safe country. Wander around in NYC at 2 AM and you still feel safe.

"And speaking of jobs...how's it going in animationland? It sucks, frankly. Cliques, tests, ugly deadlines for ugly shows."

Actually, lots of places are hiring if you're good. And theres some inspired, beautiful films being produced, amongst other that maybe arent perfect.

I still think you're being a bit pessimistic...

Anonymous said...

>>unless the buildings are falling down and people are dying in the streets of gunshot wounds from the mobs of looters and rapists and no police presence, I'm pretty sure our nation isnt in "ruin."

Depends on by what you mean by ruin. When you go to work everyday, your salary is paid by loans provided by a single central bank that also provides the loan for the car you owe money on, the loan that pays to keep the road you drive on, the loan that finances the apartment complex or house you live in, and the loan that pays to distribute to you your daily injection of processed corporate franchise food. There isn't a single thing in your geographical location - that you injest into your body, that you could define as 'first world', that is a function of 'your' economy - that is finally or partially owned by you or your neighbor or your neighbors' neighbor, ad infinitum. Nor is there any chance you will ever own a single piece of it. That, to me, is ruin. American Dream?

"I drink your milkshake. I drink it up!"

-There Will Be Blood

Anonymous said...

Left wing - right wing - same crap. this President sucks just as bad if not worse. Unbelievable amounts of debt are piling up and the out of touch elitists in Washington don't give a damn as they continue to spend the peoples money like its not theirs (wait its not). No wonder why the independents are growing so fast. The country needed a wake call, sounds like its waking up.

Anonymous said...

>>Wander around in NYC at 2 AM and you still feel safe.

Are you kidding me. NYC? The island paradise where Goldman Sachs investment bankers go to retire?

The Big Apple stopped being your apple twenty years ago. Manhattan is a fucking Sex In The City fairytale for myth-seeking oligarchy. Exactly how high is the rent in paradise now?

Anonymous said...

>>Lay off the the Boomers already

Okay. I'll stop paying my taxes to pay for your life-extending knee surgeries. You can throw me in jail so you and Dennis Hopper can golf in Taos New Mexico until your 100. What happened to crawling out to the woods to die and finally be one with nature, hippy? ;)

Anonymous said...

What happened to crawling out to the woods to die and finally be one with nature, hippy? ;)

I thought you conservatives didn't like death panels and euthanizing the elderly? ;)

Anonymous said...

>>Wander around in NYC at 2 AM and you still feel safe.

I guess my definition of ruin is a bit more literal. By safe, I mean lots of fun to be had without much fear of crime.

That, to me, is ruin. American Dream?

I dunno. Im having quite a bit of fun being an animator and eating healthy (hey, I have a *gasp* garden!). My only gripe is I wish I could afford a house with my feature animators salary. Otherwise, things seem pretty good. I dont care who owns what and what loans are whatever

I still think you're being pessimistic.

Anonymous said...

"Actually, lots of places are hiring if you're good."

Really? "Lots"?

Names, please?

Anonymous said...

i'm no conservative, just enjoying hating the banks. please, in the name of all that's holy, don't take out a loan to buy anything, including any american dreams the bank is selling you. build, rent, live on a kibbutz...cash is king.

Anonymous said...

Pixar is hiring animators. Blue Sky is hiring animators. Disney is hiring animators. Dreamworks just finished hiring a LOT of animators, but I know some who are interviewing this week. Sony is the only I know who's not actively hiring right now for animators, though they are looking for other disciplines.

Anonymous said...

Plus theres tons of video game developers hiring right now too...

Anonymous said...

**I believe that Obama is exactly what he seems to be- no more, no less. He is a bright, honest, dedicated public servant who is trying to fix what's broken. The forces against him, however, are powerful determined, and deeply entrenched. They won't change just because you ask them politely.**

"Forces against him"? S'cuse me? What forces? He controls the White House and both houses of Congress. "Bright"? Really? So how come he can't get anything done, can't explain his health care plan, insults our allies and apologizes for this country to our enemies? "Honest"? He's broken pledges and promises right and left.

We had 7 and one-half years of prosperity under Bush, which was destroyed when the Dems took over Congress two years prior to his departure and proceeded to set up the financial disaster we're in now. If Obama was "honest", the least he'd do is dump Barney Frank, who engineered the housing and credit crisis and oh yeah, dated a guy who worked for Freddie Mac (conflict of interest much)? But Obama won't do that, of course; since Frank indeed helped bring about the financial disaster that put him in the White House, I guess Obama's just takin' care of one of his peeps.

You guys kill me. You at least are working at a job you love, right? Take responsibility for your lives, instead of wanting the gov't to solve all of your problems. But I suppose that's just too Republican an idea for some of you...

Anonymous said...

"Disney is hiring animators."

You'd better inform Steve Hulett then. Last I heard they were laying OFF animators, not hiring.

Anonymous said...

Depends if you're talking about 2d or 3d. They layed off a bunch of 2D animators at the end of Frog Princess. They are in the process of hiring a bunch of 3D animators for Rapunzel.

Anonymous said...

I was talking about Rapunzel, yeah, so thanks for clarifying that.

Anyway, Im going to go back to my happy life that Ive been taking responsibility for for as long as I can remember...

Anonymous said...

That bush is responsible for the climate and attitude and lack of leadership that created the current economic situation in the U.S. is hardly debatable. Anyone who defends him should simply be pitied. Remember, he allowed 9/11 to occur--and presided over the republican congress that spent more no strings attached taxpayer money than any in history.

I agree that the big problem in animation today is bad management. Most studios wanting to do animation do not UNDERSTAND animation. It's quite appalling, when you get to see their ignorance up close, which I've had the opportunity to do. Most traditional freelance animation folks know the routine: new film, new producers/managers wanting to do it "differently," without knowing what's to be done in the first place, much less doing it "differently." It invariably falls back on the freelance pros to save their asses.

Anonymous said...

"We had 7 and one-half years of prosperity under Bush"

That is quite simply, a lie. That makes you a liar.

Not uncommon for a bushie.

Facts are the darndest things...like a surplus that disappeared in 8 months, while bush was ignoring intelligence and we were attacked by terrorists. He fabricated information to lie and get us into an uneccessary war which will make what it will cost us to undo the damage bush had done to this country look like a DROP IN THE BUCKET.

More jobs left this country under bush than any other administration in history. Salaries went down, workers had to work longer hours for less money and little health care.

Yes, bush was the worst president in history. ronald reagun is saving him a seat in hell.

Steve Hulett said...

Disney is hiring animators."

You'd better inform Steve Hulett then. Last I heard they were laying OFF animators, not hiring.


Steve Hulett sez: They lay off with one hand and hire with the other.

Hand-drawn out until Whinnie the Pooh launces; 3-D in as Rapunzel ramps up.

Shortly we'll do a profile here about who is working at what studios.

Anonymous said...

Steve what is your email? I missed your studio walkabout and I had a question.

Pls post it here thanks

Anonymous said...

So, "good enough" means CG. Not to many of us.

"Prosperity" under Bush? At least 65% of the growth under Bush was the finance industry, and we now know what that was about.

Barney Frank wishes he was as powerful as you make him out to be. Anyway, he is my new hero after the way he handled the crazies at his town hall meeting. Hospice counseling = "death panels," and "Nazism?" These people are good and desperate. (but, determined!)

Anonymous said...

So if American's question their governments actions like they have done since the beginning of the Republic, they are considered crazies now?

George Orwell couldn't have been more right when you disregard the individual and march with the collective.

On the other hand, looking forward to more 2D!

Anonymous said...

So, "good enough" means CG. Not to many of us

No, "good enough" just means "good enough." Its not my fault Disney isnt hiring 2D people right now, but you're falsely extrapolating. They'll be hiring 2D people soon, and you'll have to be "good enough" then too. But my comment about studios hiring remains true.

Yes, maybe its harder for traditional animators to find work these days, and that sucks. But like the old adage says, evolve or die. I know dozens of traditional people who have made a great living for themselves doing CG, and love it. They're still animating, just with a different set of tools. They still draw their sketch pass, so its the best of both worlds.

Steve Hulett said...

Steve Hulett's e-mail:

shulett@animationguild.org

Anonymous said...

So if American's question their governments actions like they have done since the beginning of the Republic, they are considered crazies now?.

If the questioning involves mythical, surrealist absurdities like "death panels," then yes, indeed, they are crazies.

2B or not 2B said...

"I know dozens of traditional people who have made a great living for themselves doing CG, and love it. They're still animating, just with a different set of tools. They still draw their sketch pass, so its the best of both worlds."

Yes, it's a good paycheck, but for me it's not doing what I really love, what I got into the business to do. Some of my contemporaries really took to CG and I'm glad for them, but I really don't feel that it's the "best of both worlds" . At best it's a compromise to put bread on the table. I talk to a lot of my colleagues who also transitioned from traditional to cg and they harbor the same feelings. If given the opportunity they'd go back to traditional in a heartbeat. (but gotta earn a living , so...) Of course there are also a lot of former traditional animators who have loudly proclaimed they'd NEVER go back , so it takes all kinds. Good for them. Not so much for me. I enjoy all forms of animation, hand drawn, cg, stop-motion, whatever , I just wish there wasn't this derisive attitude from some people that CG has "replaced" hand-drawn in some sort of natural-selection-survival-of-the- fittest-evolve-or-die scenario (and a good thing , too, they seem to imply) so they act as if people like me who love to draw should just get over it , move on and be glad they have a job tweaking mo-cap for video games. Sorry, it's not the same.

Anonymous said...

I didnt mean to imply one was "better," but theres no doubt its hard to find work doing 2D. So yes, if you want to make a living animating, you gotta learn CG these days, even though Im a fan of both.

Im not saying its a good thing, but "evolve or die" is accurate whether we like it or not. Heres to hoping Disney (and others) make it possible for 2D animators to find consistent, fulfilling work. In the meantime, us fighting about which is better is a waste.

2B or not 2B said...

Oh, yes, totally agree with you that the "which is better: 2D or 3D?" arguing is pointless. I've been in this game for a long time now ... prior to the ascendancy of CG when hand-drawn was the norm, I didn't think of 2D as intrinsically "better" than Stop-Motion animation, but 2D is what I did ... I just didn't do stop-motion , wasn't my thing, though I appreciated it. Same thing now with CG , though as much as I wish I was still doing mostly 2D I have (as you said) had to to change or die (professionally) . But I don't dislike CG or think it's not a valid way to animate. Just not my preference , but no one's asking me what I want to do , so I do what pays.

This popular notion of "2D is dead" that we've had to suffer under for the past 7 or 8 years is depressing. It's not 2D that is dead, it's good ideas that are dead. Yadda-yada-yada ... we've all talked this over so much it's just noise now. It won't really change until someone makes big money again at the box-office with a 2D movie.

Anonymous said...

Yeah. I hope PATF does well.

But honestly, what Id really like to see is a mixed medium, Roger Rabbit type move again

Anonymous said...

If i have to sit at a desk all day long and work for a living, i'd rather share it with charcoal, paint and canvas, in a room with the shades open. Sitting in the dark with a machine adjusting puppets is just not my cup of tea.
At least after work i can go take a walk and sell some canvases at the beach. It's a quality of life issue.

But if you like playing video games and checking e-mail every ten seconds, cool. But life's pretty short.

Anonymous said...

"So if American's question their governments actions like they have done since the beginning of the Republic, they are considered crazies now?"

That sounds like one of those emails dead end righties send to Fox. "The People" elected Obama. One of the most important planks in his platform was health care reform. All the cards were on the table. If the voters were against it, they would have voted for the other guy. Don't under estimate Obama's determination. Remember, he's the guy whose mother died of cancer after a private, (to Reagenites a synonym for "sacred"), health insurance company denied her benefits on the grounds of a "pre-existing condition." If I was the president, after that, I'd be loaded for bear.

You're right, they're plants. They are there to stage "political theater" for the cameras so that Fox could air the footage and claim that "The People" are opposed to health care reform for whatever reasons the commentators make up.

They've used this tactic before. The Republican National Committee sent "demonstrators" down to Florida to protest at polling locations to prevent a recount of the 2000 presidential vote. It was a staged media event pretending to be Democracy. Sadly, it worked. Some of these offices closed down in the face of the phony protesters.

Bushisanahole said...

"we had seven and a half years of prosperity under Bush bla bla bla..."

on what planet do you live?
how much has the illegal war on Iraq cost so far? How much has been paid to Blackwater?

Afganistan?.....

Anonymous said...

Yeah, lets put that citizen loving Saddam back in power! Oh wait i guess we can't. oh well lets get another dictator in there who will take better care of the country and its people then giving it a chance for freedom!

Anonymous said...

Yes, let's preserve America's perfect record of never supporting dictators.

Anonymous said...

Yeah, lets put that citizen loving Saddam back in power! Oh wait i guess we can't. oh well lets get another dictator in there who will take better care of the country and its people then giving it a chance for freedom!

You know what? Iraq wasn't our problem. If his people hated him, they should have risen up and taken their nation's destiny into their own hands. He was no military threat to our nation, or even his neighbors, circa 2003. There was no justification for expending our blood and money for that country.

If you are truly a person who believes in having a small, modest government, which doesn't seek to intrude on (or destroy) the private lives of others, you would agree.

Anonymous said...

So Bush gets rid of a dictator instead of supporting him, and the left howls. But it also howls when America supports a dictator. You babies are never satisfied...

BTW, I notice that the violence in Baghdad has increased since U.S. troops started pulling out. (Gotta love those timelines). I wonder how many Iraqi civilians have to die before Obama, as per his promise, sends the Marines back in again?

Anonymous said...

So Bush gets rid of a dictator instead of supporting him, and the left howls. But it also howls when America supports a dictator. You babies are never satisfied....

Just unbelievable how little some people understand. The way not to support a dictator is through economic sanctions, not doing business with them, persuading other nations not to do business, possibly helping native dissenting factions with supplies and logistics.

Actually committing our troops to a ground invasion and governmental overthrow should be an absolute last resort, for example if we have been attacked. Possibly if our ally has been attacked. None of those criteria pertained to Iraq circa 2003. There was no rational reason other than blind emotion for going in.

It is not surprising that Iraq is unstable. It likely never will be, no matter what we do. One of the many reasons why it was a fool's game to go in the first place.

Anonymous said...

BTW, I notice that the violence in Baghdad has increased since U.S. troops started pulling out. (Gotta love those timelines)...

They gotta stand on their own two feet at some point, right? Or do we give them welfare for all eternity? It's been over six years!

Anonymous said...

I like animation

Anonymous said...

I agree Bush and DIck were the worst adminstration in U.S. History. But what does that have to do with animation? They were hardly even animated themselves, and we're all paying the price.

I like animation, too!

Anonymous said...

"They gotta stand on their own two feet at some point, right? Or do we give them welfare for all eternity? It's been over six years!"

This is starting to sound like our country, the ever growing nanny state. Not to worry, the reliable politicians in government will take care of everything.

Anonymous said...

This is starting to sound like our country, the ever growing nanny state. Not to worry, the reliable politicians in government will take care of everything..

I see. So you don't mind doing it for other countries--just not our own.

P.S. There's a big difference between setting up a safety net for our own citizens, vs. getting mired in a military quagmire for an indeterminate length of time in some other foreign country, whose own citizenry don't meet us half-way.

Anonymous said...

bush wasn't the worst "president" in U.S. history.

cheney was.

Anonymous said...

LOL! Yes--the republicans wrongly believe that people are too stupid to make decisions for themselves, and that their "class" should make decisions for them. Their myth of free market capitalism includes the idea that less competition is a good thing, and that monopolies are fine, because the "mother company" will take care of everything.

Complete B.S., of course. The dark presidency of ronald reagun and shrub the first proved this.

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